Joachim Meyer's "treiben" footwork with staff and halberd

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Roger N
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Joachim Meyer's "treiben" footwork with staff and halberd

Post by Roger N » Mon Jun 13, 2011 11:37 am

Hi guys!

As you know we have been studying the halber stangen of Joachim Meyer and although I think I understand the basic footwork there are a couple of things that keep me wondering.

As we recently turned to the halberd I finally understood the mechanics of the kreutzhauw with the halber stangen as well, but using it as a treibhauw (driving cut) makes it complicated and I am puzzled by the footwork. So, what kind of footwork do you use when driving your opponent back with cross cutting? The mechanics of the kreutzhauw can easily expose you to a nachstoss... It would be really cool if you could post a video or two. :)

Cheers,
Roger
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Re: Joachim Meyer's "treiben" footwork with staff and halberd

Post by Hugh Knight » Wed Jun 15, 2011 1:36 am

Roger, why not show us what you believe this footwork to look like? Let's see a video.

Is easier for me, we have only simple steps with the pollaxe (as far as we know--no one ever mentions anything complicated).
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Roger N
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Re: Joachim Meyer's "treiben" footwork with staff and halberd

Post by Roger N » Fri Jun 17, 2011 9:00 am

I'll see what I can do, but the problem is that I really don't have a proper idea when it comes to his Treibhauw and Kreutzhauw, at least nothing that gives you any quick and good motion back and forth, while still keeping your left foot forwards as Meyer advises. Unfortunately, as far as I know Meyer says nothing else about the footwork concerning the treiben.

Still, I know that the MFFG, Francesco and a few others have worked with this, so I am curious as to what they have come up with.

The basic steps I can see that can be used here, are the simple step and the gathering step followed by a simple step. The latter gives you a bit of better reach but it is awkward, not least since you mostly hold the halberd at the end, as opposed to the pollax/halberd of Talhoffer and Jeu de la Hache.

I'll try to practice it a bit and see if I can make it work and then I'll film it.
Roger Norling

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Re: Joachim Meyer's "treiben" footwork with staff and halberd

Post by Hugh Knight » Fri Jun 17, 2011 6:44 pm

Roger Norling wrote:I'll see what I can do, but the problem is that I really don't have a proper idea when it comes to his Treibhauw and Kreutzhauw, at least nothing that gives you any quick and good motion back and forth, while still keeping your left foot forwards as Meyer advises. Unfortunately, as far as I know Meyer says nothing else about the footwork concerning the treiben.

Still, I know that the MFFG, Francesco and a few others have worked with this, so I am curious as to what they have come up with.

The basic steps I can see that can be used here, are the simple step and the gathering step followed by a simple step. The latter gives you a bit of better reach but it is awkward, not least since you mostly hold the halberd at the end, as opposed to the pollax/halberd of Talhoffer and Jeu de la Hache.

I'll try to practice it a bit and see if I can make it work and then I'll film it.
Good, I'd like to see it. You know, I find Meyer perplexing: The other German sources often seem easier to understand, frankly, even when they aren't as articulate. Maybe it's because we can use what Sydney Anglo called a "dossier approach" by comparing them to each other to make sense of technical terms, and Meyer seems to have added a bunch of technical terms no one else used (or used differently). Or, perhaps, it's just because I don't really study Meyer the same way I do the earlier sources. I don't know. But the bottom line is that reading him just drives me crazy.
Regards,
Hugh Knight
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